FFA Masters League

League => Other Events => Topic started by: Ugri2 on August 08, 2013, 11:31:32 PM

Title: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Ugri2 on August 08, 2013, 11:31:32 PM

A New map :

Thanks to the wonderfull work of our new FML member :Netherlands: :gold: Maveron, we have now access to a brand new 12 players map specifically dedicated to FFA. He spent more than 300 hours working on it over the years, this is a premium quality work.

(http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/resource_images/28/maps_27276_minimap.jpg)

All the feedbacks I have seen are extremely positive and enthusiastic. This is the first time I see map makers from hive and top FFA players from FML sharing such an excitement for a huge map like that. Now let's go play it!

Register ! :

Saturday august 10th at noon EST - 18:00 CET. I would like 12 players to register please!



Check out the map in the map download section (http://ffamasters.net/index.php?page=2)

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Seksi on August 09, 2013, 01:19:19 AM

This map looks incredible! An easy way to familiarize yourself with a new map is to:

Create a custom game offline in single player against 11 computers.  Type in the cheat "iseedeadpeople" to reveal the map.  Now you can scroll around the map with full vision and check it out.  Note the locations and frequency of important buildings:

-Taverns
-Natural Expos
-Contested Expos
-Shops
-Labs
-Markets
-Health Fountains
-Mana Fountains
-Way Points
-Merc Camps (least important)

-I have not play tested it yet, but I went through each section of this huge, epic sized 12 player map with the goal in mind to find things that I would change, add or subtract.  I could barely find anything, this map's layout is nearly perfect for 12 player FFA.

-Each of the starting spawns have enough lumber to start with and the natural expos have a good amount of lumber too.   Each starting spawn is balanced and equally spaced from each other.  The map even steers the direction of players slightly through openings and ramps that makes it 6 'pods' of 2 players each.  There are plenty of creeps of all difficulties, including many green creeps early to get the game rolling. 

-There is every type of neutral building except the one that should be left out, a Dragon Roost. 

-There are 4 Way Points that are smartly placed.  The North goes to South and vise versa while the East goes to West.  These are placed on the outskirts of the 'Town Center' which will help players traverse the map while not being excessive. 

-The layout is just awesome.  The fact that main bases are on an inner ring with natural expos on the outside makes it so the map seems smaller then it really is which is a great idea.  The Way Points add to this too. 

On first look, there are very few aspects of the map I would change.  The creator has obviously spent an enormous amount of time creating this (There are ramps, hills, etc placed all over the map).  What is great about this is that they are properly used to create a balanced map for all spawns and positions.  It is beautiful AND technically sound! I am really impressed and excited, this is the most epic map I've ever seen in wc3! 

Read his notes on Hive that go into more detail and explain the different sections of the map and how it is divided. 

NOW, the two things I will mention that I would consider altering are:

1) Inside of the City Center, there are areas that would be very tight for a large ground army.  I would make the City Center generally more open all around, but specifically in these 'hallway' spots.  Outside of the Center, there seemed to be enough spacing for ground armies throughout the rest of the map. 

2) I would consider removing the very middle diamond of terrain and leaving it wide open, maybe adding a couple fountains like Marketsquare.  The reasoning behind this it that it would create an EPIC battlefield at the very middle of the map if it was open where multiple players would encounter one another.  The terrain at the moment is unpassable and makes kind of a diamond cutout of the map that has no use. 

However, I don't mind it as it is.  Now, it divides the map up a little more to where you have to run around this diamond to meet other players.  It may serve better this way with creeping and map control/vision.   

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Jey_s_TeArS on August 09, 2013, 04:24:01 AM

This time I am in!! what time is it in France?

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Infifan on August 09, 2013, 05:40:37 AM

wow, it's really beatiful map! thx~~~

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: maveron on August 09, 2013, 08:28:56 AM

I am the creator and I keep it short!  there are being some small changes being put through all over the map to make it atleast very workable 

(some fixes on drops)
(I removed a tiny bit of creeps)
(fixing some noob mistakes such as making trees sizzly that allows for peon hiding and Goblin balloon drops, also there was a mistake that was pointed out by Persuade (thx)

I should have made Expension Creeps into normal instead of Creep mode (else you can tower abuse it)

Talk to you later and will push some more fixes asap!)

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: DarKNeSSCaLLs on August 09, 2013, 01:28:18 PM

Any official way to register or..?

Tomorrow @ 11:00 AM Central right? I'll be there

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Elessar on August 10, 2013, 04:53:18 AM

I'll play

also agree with seksi? who said the following.... (opening up the middle a little more - but dont lose that funky cool fountain! would make for an freakin EPIC battlefield like nothing FFA has ever seen before... and fountain of mana/health like in market square would make it even more epic - they would need a little more space between them than market square.. but it would be like market square without the ramps and raised bit in the middle.. just a big open battleground!.. and yer open up the town a bit more dont have the market places so enclosed etc... but yer the town does look awesome.. just change it a bit as suggested! .. and i think that a few little back alley ways and stuff and fine for sneaky escapes and blademasters! but definitely open up the whole thing into an epic battle field)... nice map bro!

Also this map should become like an icon/symbol of FFA ;) have it as like an FML logo or something ;)

1) Inside of the City Center, there are areas that would be very tight for a large ground army.  I would make the City Center generally more open all around, but specifically in these 'hallway' spots.  Outside of the Center, there seemed to be enough spacing for ground armies throughout the rest of the map. 

2) I would consider removing the very middle diamond of terrain and leaving it wide open, maybe adding a couple fountains like Marketsquare.  The reasoning behind this it that it would create an EPIC battlefield at the very middle of the map if it was open where multiple players would encounter one another.  The terrain at the moment is unpassable and makes kind of a diamond cutout of the map that has no use.

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Elessar on August 10, 2013, 04:57:19 AM

not sure about market places.. is there one or two? i cant remember from looking at it yesterday.. but it DEFINITELY needs two markets on a map this size.. and they need the GOOD items bro ;) not all the crappy cheap stuff that nobody buys and is just a total waste of time on a FFA map...

should have all the top items like a proper FFA map... crowns kings, masks, +15 claws, the frost orbs... all the aura items... khadghars gem and pipe... all the proper FFA items.

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Seksi on August 10, 2013, 05:29:29 AM

Interesting paraphrasing.  The bottom two points in your post are actually what I said  :icon_lol: But I share your excitement = 0

There are two Markets but I didn't test the item set.  I know that you cannot have a Market with both Crown of Kings and level 5 Aura items (Brilliance, Endurance, Unholy, War Drums).  The difference between markets is between Silverpine and Deathrose.  To name a few exclusive items to each market:

Silverpine: level 5 Aura items, Amulet of Spell Shield, Silence staff
Deathrose: Level 4 Aura items (Vamp, Devotion, Trueshot) level 5 Summon items (Infernal, Ice Rev), Crown of Kings

I'm not sure if you can make one super market or not, but I like the difference in selection of items between the two markets.  Each set provides different ways to set up your heroes based on availability and strategy.  If both markets were in the same game I think there would be an excessive amount of great items to choose from.  Best to choose one type. 

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Elessar on August 10, 2013, 05:53:28 AM

duh i cut + pasted your 2 points on purpose to say i agreed with them ;) wtf.

the market in the middle of rock quarry is a "super market" (har har).. has every item available in game i believe...

the balanced thing about that one is that because it has any item its not like you can just go there and buy +15 claws and go back 2 minutes later and get them again.. coz it has to cycle through a lot of items..

but anyway... crown kings/mask of death... could be done without.. but you need those level 5 items like orb frost, 15 claws, +5 ring, blink dagger in a ffa game.. and the aura items.. (pipe, endurance, doom horn, bone chimes).. especially on an epic and cool map like this one..

Essential FFA market place items!!! -

Khadgar's pipe (mana regen)
Khadgar's gem (+300 health)
Ancient jango of endurance (endurance aura)
Scourge bone chimes (vampiric aura)
Legion doom horn ("death knight" aura)
flute of accuracy (+10% ranged)
warsong drums (+10% attack bonus aura)
the stat boosting items
- medal courage (4 int, 4 str)
- helm valour (4 agi, 4 str)
- hood cunning (4 agi, 4 int)
- belt giant str (6 str)
- mage robe (6 int)
- boots quel'thalas (6 agil)
Orb of frost
+15, +12, +9 and +6 claws of attack
the 15 seconds invulnerability pot
pendant of energy (+150 mana)
+4 and +5 armour rings
sobi mask (50 % mana regen)

staff of silence - optional
pendant of mana (+250 mana) - optional but good
amulet of spell shield - optional but good

the mana stone and health stones are good to have too

seriously if you're gonna make a map this good! for free for all.. u need those big ticket items.. would be a total shame and waste not to have them (-:

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Elessar on August 10, 2013, 06:06:33 AM

On just having had another quick look at the map a few seconds ago...

You know.. that middle bit is almost open enough.. its a freakin big area.. and positioning of army etc around buildings and so on would make for some interesting battles..

I defiintely agree about the "diamond" in the middle tho... that needs to be a bit smaller at least... but that fountain looks so cool ;) i'd get rid of all the buildings and just have the fountain and some trees there for looks.. i reckon that would open it up enough.. there is already a lot of open space

also on having had another look at it.. i reckon all the rest of the terrain etc is fine... all the alley ways and stuff.. could make for some really interesting end of game hero arenas n stuff.. and also for some options for micro and positioning of army vs army fights..

just jumping back and forth from map which i have running in a custom game while im typing this... DEFINITELY DONT want to totally remove that "diamond".. it would be TOO OPEN if you took it out totally.. and yer as I said that fountain is too groovy to remove (:

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Elessar on August 10, 2013, 06:17:40 AM

just discovered you cant actually go into the "backstreets".. thats kinda disappointing... imo

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Elessar on August 10, 2013, 06:24:49 AM

well it looks like all the aura items n stuff come up in the markets

the stat boosting items i mentioned above all seem to be appearing too

theres a potion of restoration too! (500hp, 200 mana) and healing wards...

crown kings + mask of death also appear... a waste in my opinion... much better to have the items i mentioned above (frost orb, +5 ring, blink dagger and +15 claws).. which also gives more choice and flexibility for races.. i mean seriously the only hero in the game that a mask of death is worthwhile on is a blademaster..

the level 10 red dragons (x2 in total on map) drop tomes of power/crown/deathmask... even more reason to have the frost orb, 5 ring, blink dagger and 15 claws in the markets as they obviously dont drop elsewhere on the map...

all of the item drops are pretty spot on tho in my opinion.. few nice tomes including a few +2 tomes (agil. int str) around the place too... even found a tome of exp!

NICE! - need those high level items i've mentioned tho. (-:

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Elessar on August 10, 2013, 06:27:36 AM

potion of divinity and infernal stones appearing too!

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: DarKNeSSCaLLs on August 10, 2013, 11:28:33 AM

You know you can just edit one of your posts instead of making like 10 of them ...

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: FML|WorpeX on August 10, 2013, 11:29:35 AM

im registering

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: maveron on August 10, 2013, 11:35:52 AM

Everybody please after the test Game(s)  please give your feedback in this topic I will review it

I already started working on giving the center a bit more space  (from 6 square grids to 8 grids)  I made the Diamond 1 square on each side smaller ..

I  had unfortunate a save file crash so 3 hrs of work went to waiste :P

Not all the loot and drops are complete proper but I will fix that somewhere soon!

25 Min till my maps gets played

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: vain_endeavour on August 10, 2013, 11:39:55 AM

beautiful map. i would like a few animals though, for Rods, CL bus and mechanic critters beeing less obvious. thx for the huge amount of work, you can see it in the map.

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: GM on August 10, 2013, 11:48:33 AM

im in!

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: Seksi on August 10, 2013, 01:32:09 PM

I was pretty high last night, on second thought the items in a marketplace depend on the items dropped by creeps.  If there are dragons that drop Crowns and other red creeps that drop level 5 Auras, then both would be available in the Market.  Looks like there are creeps that drop the level 5 Summon items too. 

Wish I could play today! Looking forward to the replay. gl

Title: Re: Ragnarok! Saturday 10th
Post by: FML|Renaud on August 10, 2013, 02:19:10 PM

I loved the map, felt like an official one (but I din't go mid at all, so no clue about that part)

I really liked how the middle did not have 12 gold mine, meaning you had to attack someone at some point, or be forced to have only 2 gold mine vs 3