FFA Masters League

General => News => Topic started by: Pinballmap on March 26, 2012, 07:49:15 pm

Title: EM11 Result
Post by: Pinballmap on March 26, 2012, 07:49:15 pm
:FMLMN:

EM11
:USA: :ne: Nooblex
:Canada: :orc: Rygorych
:USA: :ne: Redkeekee
:Serbia: :ne: Beljone


Download (http://www.ffareplays.com/dl.php?file=EM11.w3g)


(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 26, 2012, 08:22:37 pm
A pretty fun game, once the teaming rollercoster begins.

Btw, I didn't have much left in the end Redkee, I think if you didn't rush into it you could have a pretty good chance considering how good your heroes were.

And nooblex, sorry man, nothing personal, you should take it as a compliment of how truly feared you are. Btw, if redkee didn't rush you, I would, I was going gruntapult if only you weren't so far away.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: Redkeekee on March 26, 2012, 08:54:40 pm
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 26, 2012, 09:08:24 pm
I know man, it's pretty brutal defending vs a batter who knows what he's doing, but you know what, you held out and you had this shit in the hole when you teamed me out. Your mistakes and shortcomings actually came in from this phase of the game, where I wasn't attacking you at all. You overextended trying to kill belji instead of letting me do more of the work, and then in the end I guess you believed my 33k gold bluff (I had about 10x less, with 60 food army).

I mean, I played 1-handed without a TC and 0-claw BM, the #1 part of orc cheese (hexastomp) was out of the picture... this was pretty even and you held out very well vs the brutal FS/bats harass, you made the mistake in the easy part when you had to beat my low lvl/non-cheese combo.  If you took over the remaining mines and camped me with staffs, chims and entangle, there wouldn't be much that I could do.  Instead you rushed into my towers :/ Sorry man, that's not cheese, that's just your mistake.

But with all that said, I'm ridiculously impressed by your newcomer play from last 3 rounds. I am almost inclined to think you're someone's smurf.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 26, 2012, 09:24:28 pm
Bwhahahaha BM/SH, bats, towers and caster are crap orc units, all that matters is the TC
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: Redkeekee on March 26, 2012, 09:40:11 pm
Rushing towers was my only option.  Whether or not I believed you had 33k wasn't the point.  I knew I was broke with 66 food.  If I waited at all you'd have time to get 100 and even with 10 dh it wouldn't matter.  It was all moot though after I over commit on bel.  I could have had a decent shot if I'd saved enough to go 100 for our last battle.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 26, 2012, 09:51:57 pm
he had 23k, he simply trying to make it look like he din;t hoard that much
and rushing at him was your only hope at that point
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 05:37:50 am
No.... rewatch the replay man, Redkee was at 93 food, I was at 60, building more and I had I think 7k gold.

Anyways, doesn't matter. I don't see why you're starting up all the drama Renaud.

I'm pretty cool with everyone I played this game, I think everyone played very well, except maybe nooblex, who, as I said, should apply a bit more great knowledge from his very own guide and change up the strat/race once in awhile. This was bound to happen.

Redkee did excellent, came very close, and learned alot of lessons. I think he got it in him to be a very good player. His early game macro is fucking unpredictable, and this alone is the #1 thing that makes great FFA players.

Belji played correctly as well, being the underdog, until announcing his gold. He had this in the sack.

In fact I was the worst player this game, because I 1. killed nooblex too soon and didn't take any of his mines except 1 with 6k, 2. let belji hoard 50k thinking they wouldn't team me 3. generally played badly any time it came to a battle. Bats and wolves give 2x the normal exp, so I had to be careful not to feed, but I lost  a ton of them when I shouldn't have.

Cheers all around, maybe see you guys in the semis, Redkee, I think if you get another 10 you might make it, and if you get 25, you'll make it for sure. Belji probably needs 25 only. And nooblex already made it, heh.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 10:25:04 am
I rewatched, you had 13k

Quote
I don't see why you're starting up all the drama Renaud

Because we are similar you douche.  You know how you keep on whining that hu is imba?  Well I whine about how orc is imba, the only diffrence between you and me is that I am right and you are wrong.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 10:30:53 am
Quote from: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 10:25:04 am
the only diffrence between you and me is that I am right and you are wrong.

Well I'm not sure how I argue with this constructively.

Top orc combos are 150% the strength of top UD/NE combos. Top Hu is a bit more powerful than orc, perhaps 175%. Hello list of FML champion races (what is it... 10 to 1?)

And of course, I'm right, you're wrong.

Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 11:38:51 am
List the fml finals where the orc got teamed or rushed out of the games
List the fml finals where the hu got teamed or rushed out of the games

Like you said, the best player should never win in a high level FFA game, because he will be rushed/teamed out!
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 11:44:45 am
Fair enough, but in this case wouldn't the 2nd best be considered the "real best"?
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 11:46:05 am
Depends what you call "best"
If the best player is the one who win the game, then it's impossible to beat him! (since he defined by having won the game)
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 11:49:25 am
I call best the race which has the most chances to win the game.

If orc gets inevitably teamed for being strongest, they are not best. You see, my goal is to find the hero combo for orcs, with which they are not perceived as strongest, and thus would not be auto teamed, but instead considered equal with UD and NE, and thus free to team the true "best" - AM MK PAL hu.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 12:20:07 pm
So by your logic, you are trying to find the best orc combo...
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 12:26:41 pm
Yes. Not the strongest. Best, as in best chances not to get teamed/get auto-considered overpowered.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 12:28:17 pm
What you are really tring to do, is not finding the "perfect orc combo that wont get someone teamed"

You are trying to make yourself look weak so that you wont get teamed.

You killed blex too soon?  You din't, you gained xp off of him, and tried to show RKK you where on his side (but he attacked you anywya)  You let belj hoard 50k oh noes!  You got 40k+?
You played badly in every battles?  Yet you still won by a huge margin.  You where almost broke when it became a 1v1?  You had 40x his gold!!!!

Now you will go on about not cheesing in round 4 and the semifinals (your last game was cheese).  You will even go on about making the weakest voted combo in your topic.
You will do your best to look bad in round 4 (will probably still win since your are orc...), and still say you will not cheese in the semi, then BOOM BM/TC/SH (unless it's another map where FS is better) then you will say you are sorry and will stop cheesing for the finals THEN BOOM BM/TC/SH

Then you will say you feel bad about your s12 champion title because you cheesed, so no cheese in s13! Guess what?  You will still do the same crap.

Orc should be rushed and teamed on sight, even more so if they try to convince you they are weak.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 12:40:31 pm
My corrections:
HU should be rushed and teamed on sight. Then orc.

UNLESS, Orc and HU get bad heroes, in which case they should be considered even with other races.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 12:45:58 pm
If I see a human hoarding with 8 expo and AM MK Pala and an orc bearly surviving because he took FL/Naga/BeastM

I will go for the orc, and probably lose tons of gold in the process
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 12:49:02 pm
Quote from: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 12:45:58 pm
If I see a human hoarding with 8 expo and AM MK Pala and an orc bearly surviving because he took FL/Naga/BeastM

I will go for the orc, and probably lose tons of gold in the process

Well, I can't argue with this. Your hatred clouds your judgment. I respect your opinion, and like I said, feel free to add your ranking in the strategy thread (I want to aggregate all rankings into 1, eventually, and give average scores). But as far as reassuring or arguing against your opinion when you say that AM MK PAL with 8 expo is weaker than barely alive FL NAGA BM orc.... nah, I'm done here.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 12:52:06 pm
I'm staying away from that, because when I did, I basicly took your score, added a "9." in front of all the orcs a "5." in front of the hu, and a "0." in front of the elf/ud

Figured that wouldn't help your "flame free" topic

actually I also changed stuff that I though where just wrong
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 12:59:23 pm
That's fine, I don't care what you post. If that what you truly believe and how you would prioritize targets in an even-fielded game, then that's it. Like I said, I want to aggregate 10-20 rankings and figure out what the trends are in people's perceptions.

If many people agree with you, and think orc has 2x more chance to win than hu and 10x likelier than other 2 races, then that's what we'd see.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 01:04:25 pm
You want to create a profile on everyone to help orcs win?  Why in all bloody hell would I help an orc trying to team other lesser races?
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 01:07:22 pm
Because my goal is to show which hero combos are considered less powerful.
More orcs and HU choose less powerful combos = more equality among races = more fun games rather than "hi I picked AM MK PAL/ BM TC SH, why u team me nao?"
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 01:12:43 pm
You could also go the dase way about it
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 01:16:02 pm
Quote from: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 01:12:43 pm
You could also go the dase way about it

So you want to have everyone play UD and NE only?

Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 01:22:50 pm
No, the "I won't chat to make myself weaker" way
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 01:30:40 pm
Quote from: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 01:22:50 pm
No, the "I won't chat to make myself weaker" way

No, that's silly. If you truly believe that orc is OP, just ask others to team. If they believe the same, you won't have any issues, regardless of what the orc says in chat.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 02:35:11 pm
yeah, because previous game showed that clearly chat is a place where ppl listen to the truth only
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 02:46:40 pm
I can't change that. People need to learn to scout and count up the mines for themselves. Redkee wasn't wrong to team Belji. He was wrong to team him too hard. Had he backed off in the time, and let me waste resources finishing him, it'd be much closer (it could even come to a point where belji would be the weakest, and they'd have to team me again). This has nothing to do with race, only people's scouting and filtering manip.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: Camp_and_Spank on March 27, 2012, 02:50:31 pm
cant you uber-admins add a counter for number of downloads for each game?
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 03:15:36 pm
we can't BUT we use the link on ffareplay, so you can always go there and check! so far this replay has 138 downloads
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: rygorych on March 27, 2012, 03:19:21 pm
Quote from: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 03:15:36 pm
we can't BUT we use the link on ffareplay, so you can always go there and check! so far this replay has 138 downloads

106
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|Renaud on March 27, 2012, 03:20:51 pm
o crap was looking at the other game!
/fail
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: Camp_and_Spank on March 27, 2012, 03:26:59 pm
ah, i didn't know you link from there
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: FML|WorpeX on March 27, 2012, 04:26:05 pm
yeah I don't have time to make a replay database on here, plus, I kinda like slacks. It looks like a shady porn site with FFA replays on it. Its nice.
Title: Re: EM11 Result
Post by: Camp_and_Spank on March 27, 2012, 05:23:57 pm
indeed - now extra pornish with spanking replays